Brad:
I appreciated your post. I would add "dirty" to your first line, though. Though we are always admonished not to talk about politics and religion in social settings (because talking about non-PC subjects like these might offend 'sensitive' people), I often think that these are the only two worthwhile subjects in our lives that must be talked about because they affect our PRESENT and our ETERNITY. My faith determines how I view the world and how I will respond to the world, to include those in politics who share my values. Politics is important because laws are made (by political representatives) that I have to live with, to include paying taxes to support things I do not approve of (abortion on demand, membership fees to the United Nations, research grants to study the psychology of the metro-sexual (?), or the mating habits of the beluga whale (you get the idea)). There are so many good people out there in the political realm who want the best for our society and our nation, who want to do the right things. That's why we need to stay in the political arena to ensure the RIGHT people (ha) get put into positions of authority.


I enjoy good healthy debate, either in politics or religion. I want to be persuaded by facts and ideas. So, when I and the nation had to endure two years of presidential pummeling (some call it "campaigning") that included smears, lies, innuendos, name calling, one-upsmanship, and just plain "dirty" politics...I can fully understand someone who hates politics. I went to hear Ann Coulter speak at the University of Arizona before the last election and was stunned when a couple guys tried to "pie" her. The guys missed the mark and were taken down by a couple vets in the audience and hauled away by the police. Or, how about the opposition party dragging the VPs family into the political arena (yeah, Dick Cheney's daughter is a lesbian). Where are the ideas? Where is the civility? Where is the vision?

In my 53 years on the planet, I don't remember ever observing so much HATE in the political arena. Even at Bill Clinton's worse, I never hated him. What do you expect when someone is "lost"? But when people just plain HATE George Bush, what's that all about? All who really seem to know him say he is the genuine article, a real down to earth kind a guy you could have a beer with at the local pub, a real sensitive (dare I say compassionate?) man who enjoys being around people. I don't agree with a lot of his decisions, but I think he is principled and certainly steadfast in what he believes. But, some people (15-20% of America) actually believe he is evil...so evil that he controls the weather (Hurricane Katrina) to the destruction of our US citizens. And he dragged us into that quagmire Iraq (forget about the fact that Congress overwhelmingly supported the war)! Don't you agree these folks need to put a HELMET ON?
--Ziobuck commenting on how he hates "dirty" politics

John 15:20
Remember the words I spoke to you: 'No servant is greater than his master.' If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also.

Never ceases to amaze me, that there are those who hate the God, who loves them, more than anything they could ever experience...................... jC

The only thing that concerns me about public reaction to the president, is the fact, that people just dont seem to have the imagination to consider the complications involved in making major decisions that may affect and will affect the entire planet............... It appears the people making the comments are so ignorant, that they dont even have the ability to realize, what they would truly have to do, if faced with a difficult situation. Like, religious people that want us all DEAD................. "Hey, I got a great idea,,,,,,,, lets just sit back and wait,,,,,,,, see what happens,,,,,, cross our fingers,,,,,,,, float these people some food,,,,,,,,, and hope that somehow, they wake up one day and convert to christianity, which most of us dont believe in anyway, which is our main problem to begin with, and then when all is said and done, we can all hold hands around a campfire, and sing KUMBAYAA, or whatever". No,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, wake up people,,,,,,,, the decisions being made by our President have so many little bits of information, and circumstances that only he has been faced with. And I can garauntee everyone, that he doesnt have the time in the day to explain every single circumstance that leads to every important decision. All we get is the meat and potatoes of the problem, and then it is up to us to fill in the blanks and use a little discernment. And that my friends, is where the problem lies, literally. I am sad to say that even my wonderful friends that profess to a walk in the way, at times make statements about the president and the situation in this world, that raise my eyebrows to the point of Clownship........ Use your head people, look deeper, look beyond......... and realize the absolute pressure involved in sending men and boys to die,,,,,,, in hopes that more lives will be spared....... And the last time I checked......... Everyone who signed up,,,,,, was more than aware of the possible sacrifice they might give........ Does it SUCK?,,,,,,,,, of course it sucks beyond anything we can possibly imagine. I have boys, I have daughters, and I dont want them to die......... I dont want them to die in battle, and I dont want them to die in buildings, but I am glad, that at least I have a President that worships the God of all creation..... God even created the atheist....... go figure........ One nation Under God, and when we're not,,,,,,,,,,,,, we'll know. jC

Sorry, but now I'm all fired up. Here's to the people that say things like, "HOW COULD GOD, IF HE"S SO GREAT AND LOVING, ALLOW HURRICANES AND EARTHQUAKES TO KILL PEOPLE". I am not going to answer for God. But here's a thought. Have you ever noticed how when things are going o.k., in certain areas of the world, and you try to go over there and offer the Gospel, and the KILL YOU". Have you ever noticed that?. Have you ever noticed how when an event drops a country or area of this world to its knees, that you can go love on them, and they actually come to the point of receiving. GEE, its almost like a door was opened up, its almost like a sacrifice, what was your hurricance, what was your earthquake........ What was it that dropped you to your knees?........ Well,,,,,,,, Doors have been opened, and people have died....... NEWSFLASH, people die,,,, all the time,,,,,,,,,, Last time I checked it was something to do with the wages of SIN................ So, what I'm saying is, why do people have to die, to have others brought to their knees,,,,,,,, I dont think it has to be that way,,,,,,,, But at times,,,,,,,, that appears to be true............. And here's to everyone out there that says this "They have been saying for centuries that the end of world is coming". Who are these they, oh yeah, people that probably thought it would be better in heaven then here on earth. or perhaps the people that think we're on heaven on earth, or hell on earth........ Or,,,,,,,,,,,, please,,,,,,,, stop the madness........... Something is obviously going on right now,,,,,,, something is building up,,,,,,its almost like the contractions are getting stronger, and closer together..... Its almost like doors are opening up,,,,, and it appears that all these crazy christians are going into countries and counties and states, and giving away food and the gospel of Jesus Christ. We can measure the pressure of the storm before it hits land....... But we cant measure what God is doing through his Body, in these places of devastation, and brokeness....... We are to be aware of the contractions, but we must keep our eyes on HIM, at all times. People never cease to amaze me with how much time they spend looking for signs of the Devil, when we have been told to focus on GOD. Besides that, it appears that if we would spend more time focused on our creator, we wouldnt be so worried about that old Devil. He cant get past the blood......................... So, go to your closet, pull out your dusty old Bible, and find the section in there that shows you how to put your uniform on. THE ARMOUR OF GOD. And remember Meek isnt Weak, and that you are a warrior, that balances Love, with a gentle sterness, that only GOD can provide.......... So if the storms coming at you, Repent, if the storm skirts by you, clean up the aftermath....... And if your world gets rocked,,,,,,,, repent,,,,,,,,, and if your neighbor gets rocked,,,,,, rumble his world with the word of GOD......... But most of all friends, stop complaining, and start praying, and thank GOD for everyday you walk this earth, with the full understanding, that you are SAVED............................ jC

Brad,

Before I came to know the Lord, I enjoyed my debates with liberals. Since then I now realize that it was much back and forth but no progress. (And I set my heart to know wisdom and to know madness and folly. I perceived that this also is grasping for the wind. – Eccl 1:17)

I also hate politics, and don’t like the affect politics can have on some Christians. While we are preoccupied with politics, we can forget that people are dying and going to hell. I liken this to a bull that is focused on the cape, forgetting the skillful matador who keeps moving it.

But onto a more lighthearted note, how can someone post a comment or question to you directly? Listening to your CD the other day I heard you commenting on the bumper sticker “God is my copilot”. That reminded me of a time while driving that I was going a bit fast and heard the little voice in my head say “you better slow down”. Sometimes the Holy Spirit reminds us of sin and of impending danger. In my mind’s eye I pictured the Lord in the “copilot” seat with His eyes wide and His hand on the dashboard, and in my pride I said to Him “O Ye of little faith…”

The irony made me laugh out loud.

I slowed down.

Bob Adams

I, too, used to debate liberals constantly, neither of us changing the other's mind, just getting madder and madder at each other. I also fell into the trap of "George W is of God and Slick Willie is of Satan." As I have grown closer to God in the past few months, I have turned more and more away from partisan politics and allowed my faith to dictate my political leanings. More recently I have been struggling with Christian political groups like the Christian Coalition - while on the one hand I feel that it is important that the US ensure the religious freedoms of all citizens, including Christians, I also wonder whether Jesus would really care about the US government's stance on Christianity. After all, we are called to be disciples of Christ and live according to His Word whether the government agrees with the Bible or not. And also, I believe that a hostile American government could strengthen the church in the US - too many American Christians have not truly been "refined in the fire."

Interesting last line. I see a lot of hostility in our American government. The will of the people has been challenged over and over again, especially in the courts. Talk about hostile! Now, if you are talking about persecution, I think you are right. Although there is "mild" persecution, i.e., media marginalization of Christians and ACLU attacks (boy scouts, NAMBLA, etc.), I believe there is a time coming when we will be persecuted. And we WILL be refined by fire.
--Ziobuck meditating on end times.